Tonight might not be the best night to see a movie at New Roc City. New Rochelle Police are doubling up patrol cars, holding officers over from the second shift to increase police presence throughout the City.
The mayhem began at around 11 a.m. with two men fighting on Main Street. Witnesses tell Talk of the Sound it began at the Sprint store on the corner of Main Street and Division Street. Two African-American men, one wearing a light colored top the other a dark colored shirt, began arguing. The man in the light top tried to walk away, according to witnesses, but the man in the dark shirt continued to provoke the other man. A full-block donnybrook ensued on the sidewalk in front of the store. The two men struggled until the man in the light top began throwing the man in the dark shirt up against the window of the Smokes for Less tobacco store.
UPDATE: Channel 12 News is reporting that the dispute began over allegations that one man had harassed the sister of another man. That both men were taken to Sound Shore Medical Center and both were arrested.
Al DeBara, the owner of Smokes for Less, witnesses most of it from inside his tobacco shop next door to the Sprint store.
“I heard banging against my glass so I looked outside and I see these two guys fist fighting”, said DiBarra. “a man in a light colored jacket is pushing a guy in a dark shirt up against my window, two or three times, and then he pushes him right through the glass.”
DeBara says the man in the light short was on top of the man in the dark shirt pummeling him non-stop. even after he announced he was calling the police. Both men were in the their mid to late twenties. Finally the two men got up and ran away.
“He was beating him hard”, said DeBara.
DeBara followed them out into the street. He watched as the man in the light top got into a White Suburban parked on Division Street. DeBara, a retired New Rochelle Police officer got out in front of the traffic on Division Street so the man could not get his vehicle out of his parking space. Police apprehended the man in his car. Other police offers chased down the man in the black top.
Debara said the man who was taking the beating was interviewed and then released. The man in the light top was taken away by police.
There was more mayhem in front of New Roc Deli near Spectators at 215 North Avenue a few hours later. Shortly after 4 PM, two two youths, male/black, age 14 or 15, according to the police scanner, asked a man for a cigarette. When he refused one of the boys pulled out an edged weapon and stabbed the man. The victim went to Sound Shore Medical Center on his own where emergency medical workers called police. The two boys had left the scene when police arrived.
Two men, fighting on Main Street near Division Street in Downtown New Rochelle, went crashing through the window of the . The front windows of the store were smashed. Both men suffered minor injuries. New Rochelle police arrested both men.
The location of the fight was a block away from a melee in front of I.B. Cohen in October 2007. In December 2010, a woman waiting at a bus stop on the sidewalk down the street from the scene of today’s violence was seriously injured when a car driving at high speed caused a three car collision.
The incident will be sure to increase calls for police foot patrols in the area. Over a thousand people signed a petition asking for more of a police-on-the-street presence in downtown New Rochelle after a stabbing in broad daylight which resulted in the death of Kevin Williams, a New Rochelle resident.
“On first day of spring, on the busiest shopping day, the importance of having walking police and a kiosk on Main Street continues to be the most vital need for the safety of our downtown and prevention crime,” said Jim Killorin of Westchester Habitat for Humanity a vocal supporter of more beat cops in New Rochelle.
While downtown residents and merchants are dealing with beatings at gas stations, kidnap-robberies, counterfeiters, fraud, shoplifters, roving bands of teens looking for trouble and transvestite wig thieves, officials like Barry Fertel are going on the radio to proclaim the downtown area “safe”. Fertel recently told Bob Marrone that the one block area near his office at 270 North Avenue, between Huguenot Avenue and Garden Street, is “safe”. In the past six months there have been dozens of criminal incidents including a murder with a kitchen knife directly in front of Fertel’s building, a drug overdose at 309 North Avenue and a brutal murder where a woman was hacked to death by a man with a machete. By any measure two murders in six months is not “safe”.
Another robbery on centre ave. bridge. Two male blacks take persons boots
Brian has no problem with placing labels on women…
Brian has no problem with labeling women, just violent people the police are trying to find before someone else is hurt.
As Usual, ladyjustice Exhibits Her Malice & Ignorance
As usual, ladyjustice exhibits her malice, ignorance and makes no sense. I have no idea what she is complaining about regarding me, nor does anyone else, probably including ladyjustice herself.
Out of the blue, with no apparent connection to anything other than her usual irrationality, ladyjustice posted the following garbage:
“Brian has no problem with labeling women, just violent people the police are trying to find before someone else is hurt.”
I have labeled no women with anything about anything, so I and everyone else have no idea what ladyjustice is referring to. This is her second irrational and personal attack on me, in a similar out of context manner.
I am unaware of any comments I have made on any women, that ladyjustice can possibly be referring to. Apparently, it seems that ladyjustice is defensive of the alleged prostitutes that TOTS had reported had been arrested. I had made no comments on those alleged prostitutes, but rather I simply had defended Mayor Bramson for obeying the law, against the irrational attacks by ladyjustice on the Mayor. As a result, ladyjustice has twice attacked me, although she has no rational basis for her weird accusations. I must ask, why are you so concerned about Mayor Bramson having two alleged prostitutes arrested?
Ladyjustice claims to know me personally, but because she is a coward, she attacks people with her lies and false allegations, while withholding her name. As such I have no idea if I ever have met ladyjustice at all.
I can only imagine why ladyjustice is disturbed. Presuming that ladyjustice is actually a woman, and that she actually knows me personally as she claims, I must assume that somehow, in the dark recesses of her mind, that she is acting out at me, because she somehow feels ignored by me – kind of like some disturbed 7th grader with an unrequited crush. I pity such a person, whoever she is, and I hope she seeks some psychological help before her fantasies and irrational reactions overwhelm her.
Your attempts to white wash the news will not work
If the perps are black, white, orange or green it should be reported as such.
Your attempts to whitewash the news that is reporting a fact is racist. Why the push for censorship? The first one to make an issue of race and push for censorship was you and if you say something I do not agree with I will certainly let you know.
When it suits your purposes you are the first one to apply labels.
You have no trouble applying the whore label multiple times in previous posts and then turned it down a notch (after I flamed you) in this post calling them prostitutes. How do you know these women, were you there, did you pay for their services. If you were not there, you do not know. If you insist you do know, then how? I never placed you there with them but if you insist that they are whores and then prostitutes, you must have first hand knowledge. The voracity of your statements in previous posts leads the reader to believe that despite your denials you know a lot more about this than you are saying.
sussman
Get over your detail.Brian your nuts and every ones knows
PS Brian,
The JN does it all
PS Brian,
The JN does it all the time especially with illegal immigrants.
To truthertz2 re: The JN does it all
We all recognize that the Journal News is garbage. I am not putting down the JN’s reporters here, but the JN itself.
Therefore the ‘Talk of the Sound’ lowers itself when it seeks to emulate any racist reporting emanating from the JN.
A much better journalistic publication to emulate is the NY Times, easily one of the most professional and serious newspapers in the world, let alone in the USA.
When on occasion, the NY Times slips up, and accidently reports an alleged criminal’s race in a situation where race had no relationship to the crime, the NY Times official policy is to apologize and to restate their policy as being to not report ethnicity or race, unless ethnicity or race is specifically at issue in the controversy.
Of course, the decency of such policies goes over the heads and amorality of insensitive or poorly educated persons and of bigots who think race is always an issue in an alleged crime.
BTW, I am not criticizing Robert Cox, who might well have been accurately reporting the bigoted news of the Journal News, but in the future he should consider the sensitivity of racial reporting in a country long plagued with racism.
I would have been more impressed however, if TOTS were to criticize the JN for the JN’s apparent racism, rather than for TOTS to quote the JN article verbatim.
Also, I am not criticizing truthertz2, who merely pinned the racism on the ass we know as the Journal News.
By my commenting here, on the racial reporting regarding the recent incidents in New Rochelle, I have made TOTS a better, more respectable source of news than TOTS would be if no one made such criticism.
That TOTS allows free and speedy discussions of so many issues, demonstrates the value of Talk of the Sound, and I complement Robert Cox for providing this open source of information and debate.
I have criticized the JN on this policy
See here: http://www.newrochelletalk.com/node/1395
Here is the conclusion of that article…
The interest of the community are not served by withholding information that might help the community identify police suspects to police including the appearance of the suspect if known including if they appear to be white, black or whatever. The pair that brutally beat a man in the head with a metal pipe showed a depraved indifference to human life. They could just as easily killed them man. Is the Journal News so afraid of reporting that a suspect is black when the police report identifies the suspects as black that they would place political correctness above public safety? The country has already seen how political correctness allows a person with explosives shoved down their pants board an aircraft in attempt to kill 300 people. We do not need that here.
Residents of New Rochelle are white, black and other races and ethnicity. Almost all of them are law abiding citizens who want to be protected from the sort of thugs that appear to be running around on Shore Road/Echo Avenue. I submit that none of them — black, white, or any other race — wants to be beaten senseless with a tire iron and will support police in reporting the suspects if they are seen on the streets. Intentionally withholding this information in cases where the assailants are black is irresponsible and dangerous.
To Robert Cox – When Reporting Race is Appropriate and When Not
I was just about to read your posting Sunday Night, when suddenly TOTS disappeared for the rest of the night. I’m sure you know what I mean. Glad to see TOTS is back on line today.
So, I just read your post, ‘I have criticized the JN on this policy’, expecting to see that in the past you have criticized the Journal News for inappropriately, excessively reporting on Race, only to find that you had previously done the exact opposite.
For, in the past you had criticized the Journal News, on 2011-01-08, for inappropriately, failing to report on Race.
I don’t disagree with you, if you are asking for consistency in reporting by newspapers. And on 2011-01-08, you had brought up two situations where alleged perpetrators had left the scenes of two different crimes. In the reporting of one alleged crime, according to the NRPD, two blacks were involved but the Journal News failed to report their race. In the reporting of the other alleged crime, according to the NRPD, one white woman was involved, and the Journal News did report her race. I hope you agree with my summary of your 2011-01-08 posting.
I agree with you, that if a newspaper, or a website acting as a newspaper, reports an alleged perpetrator’s race but doesn’t report the race of a different perpetrator’s race, that it would appear to be an inconsistency. But there are distinct differences between the nature of the reporting of the two alleged crimes commented by on by you 2011-01-28 in your posting “Journal News ID’s suspect in recent burglary as ‘Blonde, Caucasian’, Fails to ID Sutton Manor Assailants as ‘Black’”, as compared to the other two alleged crimes commented by on by you 2011-03-05 in your posting “Spring Fever Hits New Rochelle: Fight on Main Street….”.
In your 2011-01-08 Posting, you referred to two crimes where, in each case, the alleged perpetrators escaped, and therefore the authorities were still looking for them. Race was not an issue in those crimes, and had the perpetrators been captured on the scene and arrested, it would have been a bit racist of the JN to report on their race.
However, reporting of race would have been appropriate only because the alleged perpetrators had escaped. As there might have been witnesses to the alleged criminals escaping the scene, it might have helped unknown witnesses reveal information, based on their being aware of the alleged race of the alleged perpetrators. On the other hand, such information being reported might aid some racists in framing innocent persons – certainly that is the history of racism in the South. So I am of two minds regarding your 2011-01-28 posting “Journal News ID’s suspect in recent burglary as ‘Blonde, Caucasian’, Fails to ID Sutton Manor Assailants as ‘Black’”. I am unsure whether the JN’s error was reporting a perpetrator as White, or if the JN’s error was failing to report two perpetrators as Black. Either way I agree with your 2011-01-28 posting that there was an inconsistency in the JN reporting at that time, regarding reporting of alleged perpetrators who left the scene of crimes and who were being sought by the Police.
The nature of the incidents you wrote of in your 2011-01-28 Post, are similar to one incident you reported on 2011-03-05, the incident where two youths stabled someone at 215 North Ave, as the perpetrators escaped, and therefore a detailed description might been appropriate in apprehending the perpetrators, or perhaps inappropriate because such information might aid a racist in framing up Blacks. As such I am of two minds regarding whether their race should have been reported.
It is the other, and main incident you posted about on 2011-03-05, that has me concerned. This was the incident where two Black men got into a fight, ultimately falling into and breaking the window at ‘Smokes for Less’ tobacco store on Main Street. In that incident, the two alleged perpetrators were caught before the incident was reported by JN, TOTS or Channel 12. Because the alleged perpetrators had already been apprehended and were not being sought, there was no reason for JN, TOTS or Channel 12 to report on their race, other than sloppy reporting at best, or racial sensationalism or even racism at worst.
Certainly, all racists thrive on reading news or hearing gossip that confirm their racism, and therefore all responsible TV stations, newspapers and news-reporting web sites are morally and ethically obligated to avoid reporting on race, if race has no bearing on an alleged crime. After all this is the USA, where racism long ago took root, and continues to blossom, often unconsciously, in subtle and overt ways.
OK
As you and other readers should know, I do not base what I do on comments from the peanut gallery. but I have read your comments. I understand precisely what you are saying. I just don’t care.
This is the same sort of liberal guilt clap trap I have been hearing for decades. You think there is something NEW in what you have written?
You are welcome to write up articles on incidents like this as you see fit. You can start your own web site and create your own policies.
My Reply to Robert Cox’s 2011-03-07 Post ‘OK’
I agree with you that there is very little new in anything that anyone says. That has always been the case, and truly new and unique thoughts are rare.
I realize that Talk of the Sound is a hotbed of local Republicanism. Therefore you should be thrilled that unlike those other Democrats who visit TOTS, I actually post here, and unlike so many cowards hiding behind avatars, I actually use my real name – something that you cannot deny represents my integrity, much more so than others who attack people’s reputations while hiding behind fictional names.
In general, statewide and nationally, Republicans tend to be reactionary or ultra-conservative, longing for their imagined good ol’ days (whenever that was).
I have no respect for such ignorance, because there were no good ol’ days, except for maybe the 1960’s when there were active civil rights, feminist and anti-war movements, and when Medicare and Medicaid were created. It is no coincidence that in the 1960’s while our economy was booming, Unions were strong, and liberalism was as its peak.
It’s also no coincidence that since the 1960’s, the Republicans have gained strength, mostly in the ignorant former Confederate States, resulting in the fact that since the 1960’s our Unions have weakened, our financial institutes have been deregulated, our economy has weakened, and our news media and politics have become more conservative if not reactionary. Certainly it is the conservative movement that has destroyed our economy and increasingly made the USA an amoral nation.
But what I like about the Republicans in New Rochelle, is that they are rather liberal regarding the governmental policies of New Rochelle, perhaps more liberal than New Rochelle’s Democrats. Unfortunately, New Rochelle’s Republicans revert to counter-productive conservatism when it comes to County, State or Federal matters. Fortunately, New Rochelle’s Democrats assert productive liberalism when it comes to County, State or Federal matters.
The thing about TOTS, is that for Robert Cox, it is a very personal matter, but for most others, this site is not about Robert Cox and his personal concerns, but rather TOTS is about New Rochelle.
I have no problem with Robert Cox exhibiting and advocating for his personal concerns here, other than that it sometimes overwhelms the more important concerns of most others about New Rochelle. But that’s fine – it is Mr Cox’s website – unfortunately it also sometimes detracts from the civic usefulness of this site.
Personally I, and probably everyone else, don’t care whether Robert Cox agrees with me or others or not – why should anyone care?
And it is equally unimportant to me and to others, whether we agree with Robert Cox.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion. I am just concerned when people think they are entitled to invent their own facts.
I have no idea what Robert Cox means by “This is the same sort of liberal guilt clap trap I have been hearing for decades.” If he wants to consider truth to be clap trap, that would seem to be an admission that he is in denial.
So I must ask, Robert, what do you think of the Civil Rights Movement of the 1960’s – was that liberal crap trap? And was Lincoln’s Emancipation Proclamation liberal clap trap? Was giving women the Vote liberal crap trap? Is Social Security liberal crap trap? Was fighting Hitler liberal crap trap? Conservatives were against all of that. Whether liberalism is a clap trap is open to question, but I am certain that conservatism is a trap that is destructive of our American society and economy.
Dear, Mr. Sussman
You are blowing this whole thing way out of proportion. Part of journalism is painting a picture of an event through words. Your point is noted about race not being the point of conflict in this particular incident but being the race police only stirs up unnecessary trouble.
Furthermore, walking around calling other people bigots is a dangerous thing, especially when you know nothing about them.
I realize that growing up in the 60’s makes you partial to these conditions and you seem to have a passion for it but times have changed. As someone half your age growing up in New Rochelle I can attest that race was never an issue in the schools and community until it was brought to attention and forced on kids. Young adolescents naturally accept each other equally until it is pointed out through some sort of race card that they have a history of violence or disagreement. It only perpetuates those to see each other differently. Why keep re-creating this? How can we move on if we can’t let it go?
I would have considered your last argument more seriously and may have given you credit had you not gone ahead and shown your true colors by quickly labeling everyone as bigots. Bigots hate. The only things I hate are racism and religious wars and I think it’s ridiculous that we still fight over the same stupid sh*t year after year so don’t try to label me. I haven’t labeled you in any way and creating labels is, correct me if I’m wrong, a very racist thing. So what does that say about you?
P.S. I love how I turned into Lyle Butler by the end of your rant. Not bad.
If Race Isn’t an Issue of Crime, Race Shouldn’t Be Mentioned
For those who think its morally ok for an article to refer to the race of the suspects, even if race was not an issue in the alleged crime; to put things into perspective, let me pose this question:
If the suspects were Catholic, and the alleged crime had nothing to do with religion, should the article mention they were Catholic?
Brian,
Catholic is NOT a
Brian,
Catholic is NOT a physical description. In this case, the author was trying to provide a physical description of the suspect.
Nice try
Catholicism is not a race, it’s a religion. It is not a physical attribute when describing a suspect. That would be equivalent to the police putting out a call for “two men who believe in Santa Claus.”
To Kyle Butler re: Nice Try
Kyle Butler either misses the point, or condones racist journalism. I will restate my position here, and if Kyle Butler continues to miss the point, and continues to think racist reporting is fine, he merely reveals his amorality to the rest of the world.
The funny thing is about Kyle Butler’s logic, is that his response, if anything, proved my point.
Kyle Butler posted “Catholicism is not a race, it’s a religion. It is not a physical attribute when describing a suspect.”
Exactly. It is as bigoted to report one’s religious beliefs as much as to report one’s race, if the reporting has nothing to do with the basis of the alleged crime.
If a Catholic were to throw a Baptist through a Window, and the fight was over either participant criticizing the other participant specifically regarding their religion, then it would be appropriate to report those circumstances in a journalist article. But if religion was not an issue in the dispute, then the article is bigoted by reporting their religions.
Likewise, if a White were to throw a Black through a Window, and the fight was over either participant criticizing the other participant specifically regarding their race, then it would be appropriate to report those circumstances in a journalist article. But if race was not an issue in the dispute, then the article is bigoted by reporting their race.
But in a country with an infamous racist history, such as the USA, reporting the race is especially a sensitive issue.
The funny thing is, Lyle Butler turns things on its head, because as he says, one has no choice as to their race, whereas one has choice as to their religion. To be consistent with that logic, it makes less sense for a news article to report something one has no choice over, such as race, and in comparison to race, it makes more sense to report on one’s religion, as religion is something done by choice.
However, Lyle Butler is splitting hairs, as the keyword is bigotry. Actually, reporting on a person’s race or religious beliefs are equally inappropriate if the incident had nothing to do with race or religious beliefs. Such facts would only be meaningful to a bigot.
lets add two more
Two more robbiers occured overnight one at anderson and north ave.And another on the centre ave. bridge.GO new ro.
Way to go Al! Didn’t know
Way to go Al! Didn’t know you retired.
Also, how could anyone make an issue out of using the term “African American” in an article. I hardly see that as a racist comment, just like some people don’t see “sleeps with the fish” as a threat.
JUST ANOTHER DAY IN NEW ROACHVILLE
JUST ANOTHER DAY IN NEW ROACHVILLE…..AND ANYBODY WHO SAYS THAT NR IS “SAFE” HAS NO GRASP ON REALITY, OR IS A PATHOLOGICAL LIAR.
Why Bring Race Into the Article
Why did the article mention the race of anyone in this article?
Was race an issue causing these fights?
Is race being referred to because of bigotry?
These are Police blotter/scanner stories
The terms used by the government for these incidents are “male black” or “male black teens”. This is how the police dispatcher puts out the calls, how the patrolman report back to HQ and how NRPD puts out info to press. It is normal to report age and physical description of suspects.
If you are barking up the “political correctness” tree you are wasting your time. I do not base my editorial policies on anything other than what I believe to be correct. If you don’t like how the NRPD describes suspects give them a call.
Really?
It’s called a suspect description. Let’s not try to make racial issues out of everything here. It’s just another excuse to divide people along with religion and it comes off as a defensive comment. I doubt anyone could care less or make a spectacle if the article read “two Caucasian men” so why should it affect you?
You are absolutely right Kyle.
It is clear that certain elected officials are drinking Kool Aid. I pass through downtown, I truly feel for the people who live in the towers and have to leave the safety of their apartments to go to work and to walk their dogs.
Jim Killoran is absolutely correct. We need foot patrols downtown. When the criminal element see that the police stay in their cars, and do not walk the beat, things happen, crimes occur and people die.
All the while city hall fiddles while New Rochelle burns.
Can we all survive until the next election so we can vote out the incompetence.
We need police boots on the ground not riding by in their cars only stopping out to give parking tickets.
Is race being referred to because of bigotry?
One could argue that withholding the race of the offender is patronizing and racist in its own way.
Race
Brian call the new Rochelle police department and tell them to stop using the term male black . I listen to the radio and watch the news they use this term all the time. Why is it that you always try to find wrong in articles on this site.Do you call the journal news and patch to when they do wrong?
No
Race was not referred to because of bigotry. As I wrote the article, you are asking me if I am a bigot, right? The answer is no, I am not. Believe it or not it is possible to mention race or ethnicity in an article about a police event and not be a bigot.
If you believe that providing a physical description of a police suspect is a sign of bigotry you had better not listen to a police scanner, read the police blotter or an incident report or arrest record. You might be horrified to find that it is standard operating procedure to provide a physical description — approximate age, skin tone, clothing, etc. — of a suspect or suspects.
In the window case you would have heard “two male blacks. twenties” or something like that. In the stabbing case “two male blacks, teens”.
The Journal News has the policy that you seem to want where the race of suspects is not reported when the suspects are black. They routinely report if the suspect is white or Latino but not black. So, readers develop the tendency to ASSUME that if the race or ethnicity of a suspect is not mentioned they are black. I have discussed this with the Journal News and what I got back was that they do not report if the suspect is black because they get too many complaints.
Talk of the Sound is about providing the actual story not some bastardized, politically-correct, BS version of the story. If you want that get a subscription to the Journal News, God knows they need the readers!
get over it
Brian stop your CRAP stop trying to make a racial issue out of everything. You are a Noam boy and get used to it, your party tells you what to do and you follow there lead.
mr. fertel
clueless, just a mimic monkey for the mayor.
If Mr. Fertel has any original thoughts – he is keeping them to himself.
Bulletin, 95% of the Police have been pulled back – starting from Eastchester to the Scarsdale border – protect — 10804 at any costs!!!
Spring is in the air
Good ole New Ro. It never lets me down.